Assuming your status as a "TikTok artist" doesn't always have to be a curse - you can turn it into a blessing if you know how to navigate social media marketing. That's how Rachel Bochner, the singer-songwriter behind "ghosted my therapist," is proving that she has what it takes to be the next big thing in pop music. The pipeline from industry professional/communications major to artist is becoming increasingly common. Such a background allows independent artists to make the most of what they have, especially in a competitive scene with lots of pressure from multiple directions. Before arriving at her solo artist career, her unconventional path into the music industry gave her a unique skillset, which allows her to stay on the rise in multiple ways.
Her upcoming EP encapsulates her signature sound well, blending light and bouncy elements with the more edgy aspects of pop music. Rachel is preceding the project with powerful singles like "Sucker Punch" and "If I'm Gunna Be Sad," and she has another called "Here For The Drama" on the way. Rachel revealed to us what fans can expect in this fun new song, which will come out on June 22nd! Read our full conversation with her below.
Image credit: Carina Allen; graphic created by Karly Ramnani
YOU'LL LOVE RACHEL BOCHNER IF YOU LISTEN TO: Taylor Swift, Maisie Peters, Gracie Abrams, Ellise, Julia Michaels, Tate McRae
Let's start at the very beginning! What inspired you to get into music in the first place?
I definitely loved music, and I loved putting on shows since a really young age, but I didn't actually start writing songs until much later. I want to say that I didn't start seriously writing until 2018. For a while, I thought that because I loved music so much, it meant that I should work in music in some way - like work at a label. It just didn't click for me that I could pursue my own artist career. I interned at a record label in the summer of 2018, and I was in their A&R department. I guess maybe I just had a lot to say - I don't know what prompted me to actually sit down by myself and write, but those things happening together made me realize that I needed to be the artist and not the A&R. Since then, I shifted entirely and have been pouring my heart and soul into the artist thing.
I love that! I love how one aspect of the industry can lead you into others.
Yeah! When you're trying to figure out what you're passionate about, you kind of have to try things and realize that you hate something to get closer to what you love. Before I really knew that music was what I want to do, it was important to try different things, and find the bits of it that I liked and the bits I didn't. I went to college - I have a degree in communications, and there obviously were a lot of parts of school that I was like "okay, I'm obviously more passionate about music than anything else." But, because I have this experience doing other things, I have a lot of skills that I wouldn't have probably gotten if I just went to music school. It helps you gain perspective, and I think because of my weird path to getting where I am now, I have a better grasp than I would have on how to be an artist right now, with social media. And having to be the marketing person, and the songwriter, and all the different things for yourself, because that's kind of the reality right now.
Exactly! The industry is becoming more welcoming towards independent artists like yourself, but it's tough unless you're able to wear all the hats. What college did you go to, and what record label did you intern at? Are there any specific takeaways from these experiences you'd like to share with newcomers?
I'm from New York and grew up 30 minutes outside of the city. But I went to college in Richmond, VA, at the University of Richmond which is a liberal arts school. I didn't know [what I wanted to major in] - I think deep down I did, but it took time to pull it out of me. I ended up "making" my major, but it was some communications type of thing. I was always trying to force music to be a part of my projects, and just the different things I was focusing on. Honestly, sometimes I look back and I'm like, "You are so stupid." All along the way, I feel like the signs were literally in my face, and I didn't get it, but it's fine. Sometimes you have to take the long way around. But I went there, and Richmond is a very beautiful place. It's an interesting place, it's a little complicated - I loved the city, didn't love my experience at the school. But I think that's just because I wanted to do something in music, and didn't know how to admit that to myself. It sounds silly, but I think it's hard to pursue something that's so uncertain, and there's no clear cut way to do it.
I interned at Republic Records, and that was in New York. A great experience all around at that internship, and like I said, having different experiences and trying out different things helped me gain knowledge that I wouldn't have gotten, if I had just had my head down writing songs. I got really valuable industry experience through that, which has shaped the way I manage my own artist career, in a way I think is positive.
I think that this truly shows there's more than one way into music, and you certainly do not have to be born into a musical family, or have such connections from the time you're young, or be a child star. It literally is never too late to realize your dreams.
Yeah!
One thing I found interesting about your strategy is the Rachel's Ghosties Discord server! I love how active and engaging you are there. It's definitely a much less toxic way to make friends in the fandom than Stan Twitter, for example.
Yeah, Stan Twitter is scary!
Do you feel as though your experiences in college and with Republic Records particularly helped you with the management of this Discord server?
Whether or not it's obvious to me, probably yes. The Discord kind of happened organically, and I'm so grateful that it did. There was the "Pretty When You Cry" crying selfies I did in January 21. I was getting all of these people DMing me the photos for the canvas of that song, and it was like, "Okay, wow! There are a lot of people coming to my page, who are excited about this song and learning about my other songs now." I feel like I want to have one place where I can communicate with the people who really care.
I think social media is kind of a funnel - with TikTok, you can have a lot of followers but not necessarily a lot of people actually watching your videos, and engaging with you and caring. And it's a fact that a lot of the TikTok followers I have, they found me through "ghosted my therapist," which is awesome, but just because they followed me through that song doesn't mean that they know that "Drunk Crier," for example, is the same artist. Bridging that gap is a challenge that all artists have to tackle. So yeah, TikTok is the big part of the funnel, and then Instagram is a little bit smaller. People see your content more when you follow someone on Instagram than you would on TikTok. And past that is the Discord. You really have to put effort in to join the Discord, so you know that those people actually give a shit. The reason why I love the Discord so much is the fact that there are people that care enough to even be in it. It's so meaningful to me, and makes what I'm doing more fun because I get to involve the Ghosties! It's the best thing ever, and as it grows, I see people becoming friends. It feels really rewarding and lovely. Whether or not my school background and internships impacted that - maybe yes, but I think it's also the philosophy that I have developed as I've been trying to create this community. It's extremely important to me as a person and as an artist. I always want to make sure that the people who care feel valued and appreciated.
You have so much impact, because you singlehandedly brought this community of people together. And that's a slay, if you ask me.
Major slay.
You have a "Swiftie Conspiracies" channel on the Discord. I love how the Ghosties fandom has so much overlap with the Swifties. If you think about it, it kind of makes sense - with the similarities in the themes, the introspective songwriting, there's a lot. So I have to ask what's your favorite album?
For a long time, I would've immediately said Reputation. That would be my instinctual response, but I've been coming back to Folklore a lot. I don't know, so now maybe Folklore is taking it for me. But honestly, it depends on my vibe. I love pop music, but I also love good writing and pretty music that makes me feel something. Also, she really doesn't miss, so that makes it hard. I literally have a playlist on Spotify where the title is something like "when people ask me what my favorite Taylor Swift song is and I can't pick one so I just send this playlist."
For real! As best as you can, because I know it's hard to narrow things down sometimes - what songs of yours would you recommend to fans of each of her albums?
I feel like this EP that I'm rolling out right now is more Reputation vibes. It's a little angry and angsty - not like Reputation is angry, but it's her more edgy album. So I feel like "Sucker Punch" and "If I'm Gunna Be Sad" feel more Reputation than anything else. I think "Drunk Crier" feels like1989 to me. I want to choose one for "ghosted my therapist" because it's a song more people would know, but I don't know!
I would say "ghosted my therapist" feels like Folklore and Evermore but without the fairytale/cottagecore elements, in a sense. Or one of the slower songs on Midnights.
I buy that. I feel like sonically, I gravitate more towards Reputation or1989 or Midnights. It's funny, because when I'm writing on guitar by myself, the vibe always starts like Folklore, but once it actually gets produced I take it in a more pop, alt-pop, indie pop direction.
Your new single "Here For The Drama" definitely has the Reputation vibes. Talk us through the inspiration - is it based on real life events?
With a lot of my music, things are inspired by some sort of real catalyst. Whether it's some relationship thing, or some feeling, it's usually triggered by that. There are some songs where it feels really important to me to have everything 100% factually correct - if I'm really kind of getting into the specifics of a story, I want it to be on paper like [it] actually happened. But I'm a dramatic girlie. I have to exaggerate sometimes. I just write what still feels authentic to the feeling I try to convey, but sprinkle a little imagination in there. "Here For The Drama" is partially true. I love the messiness and the chaos, and I'm just here for it. It started off just being like [when] you have some people in your life that are always going through some shit, and it's always a little bit crazy and unhinged. And you're like, "How do you keep up with all this stuff? It's wild, but like tell me more. I want to know everything." So it kind of just started as a joke about when you have that kind of friend in your life. You just remind them that like, "As messy as your life gets, I'm your guy. I'll be here to help clean up the mess and probably enjoy the show at the same time." But it's funny how with songs, the meaning can evolve after it's been written. That happens when I listen to a song - a Taylor Swift song, for example - what I took from it when I listened to it five years ago could be totally different to what I take from it [today]. Even for my songs. When I wrote "Here For The Drama," it felt like I was the one watching it. And now when I sing it, or perform it, or hear it, I'm like "Shit. Now my life is the one that is chaotic." The song feels like it's about me now.
I love hearing it from both perspectives - of the person who's going through the drama, and the person who's watching and being the emotional support.
Yeah, the toxic cheerleader. You know when your friend's like, "He broke my heart." And then you're like, "Okay, let's go egg his house, key his car, and steal his mom."
Even if you're not actually going to do that, because that would be illegal, having that toxic cheerleader friend is good for the soul.
A little chaos is good for the soul. It builds character, and it keeps things interesting. And as an artist, you need material! You have to live your life and go through some shit to have something to write about. Maybe it's short sighted of us, but it's so real. I love the Folklore type of thing where you can be imaginative and write stories, and I will forever weave that into my writing as well. But there is something to be said about having a come-to-Jesus moment where you're like "Holy shit. I just went through something crazy," and then a song pours out. That's unmatched.
Another of your songs is "Graduation," and many seniors just graduated! Do you have any words of wisdom for the Class of 2023?
There's an overwhelming bittersweet feeling that a lot of recent graduates are experiencing. I think the takeaway from that song is that my life got so much better in the years after I graduated. No matter how amazing (or not amazing) your high school or college years were, you're just getting started, and there's so much left for you to experience and to do and to feel. I'm so grateful for all of the things that I've been through, because one way or another, they have brought me to where I am now. And where I am now is so much better off than I was when I was graduating high school and college. Enjoy it, or mourn it, and feel however you feel, but know that it's just going to keep getting better.
So true! Thank you so much for saying that.
It's so funny, because Aly, a member of the Discord, got a tattoo of a lyric in "Graduation" on their arm. It's so crazy, but it's amazing seeing people resonate with any song that I put out. That's so special.
That's why writers do what they do, and it's the most rewarding thing ever. Now for the final question, the P&P classic which I ask everyone! In your single "Here For The Drama," what's your favorite lyric and how did you go about writing it?
That's kind of tough, because I feel like the whole song is pretty lighthearted. There aren't any lyrics in that song that are cutting deep for me. This is a fun song, but I guess in the chorus, the line that really encapsulates the vibe is "It's a loaded gun, chaotic but it's so fun." That's the part what I'm really resonating with right now in my life. I feel like I suddenly accidentally manifested all of this excitement, and drama, and chaos, and sometimes that's really stressful. But it's all kind of fun. I'm here for a good time, not a long time, so you just have to embrace the messiness. That line is self-explanatory too - "this might be toxic of me, but I'm here for the drama, and I'm enjoying it." Maybe that'll end up biting me in the butt later on, but for now, we're having a good time, so it's fine. Everything's fine.
Everything is fine, indeed, when we are listening to Rachel Bochner. A wide range of listeners can identify with her unique brand of pop music, and more importantly her personal story. Rachel's perspective truly shows that all of the artists we listen to have to start somewhere, and they have more in common with us that we might think! If we've convinced you to join the amazing community that she has created, or at least give her music a try, we've curated just the playlist for you.
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